Mike “OD” O’Donnell, Audacy,
OM/Brand Manager, WKRZ ,WGGY & WLMZ
March 22, 2023
by Fred Deane
Mike O’Donnell
Mike “OD” O’Donnell is one of the most respected programmers in our business. A seasoned pro, astute, very knowledgeable, and very perceptive regarding the trends, and ebbs and flows of radio…in multiple formats. He’s in his fourth decade serving the Northeast PA market via the Entercom and Audacy assets he’s been leading throughout that time period. In an industry that sees much movement for programmers over that course of time, stability has been a hallmark trait during OD’s career. He gets involved with everything radio including engineering when he’s called upon and is very resolute in his decision-making process. He continues to guide two powerhouse stations in WKRZ and WGGY whom have been market dominant for three decades and counting.
You possess several admirable qualities as a programmer and manager, how quickly did you grow into being a self-assured programmer?
I definitely had some room to grow! In 1997, when I first became a programmer at WRZE in Cape Cod, I was an awful manager. I learned early on that you’re not going to grow without making mistakes. If you’re not making mistakes, you’re probably not pushing your limits. Part of growing is trial and error.
You also have to be open-minded, and be a good listener, which is something I needed to do better. I always know what I want from the get go, but I’ve learned to take in all the input first and draw my conclusions and then make sound decisions.
When did you feel that you came into your own as a manager?
When I arrived in 2007 to Wilkes-Barre. I had learned a lot about myself as a manager and really developed to the point where I felt I was making excellent decisions enabling me to accomplish what I wanted to do, and that’s probably why I still call it home.
You oversee two perennial winners in behemoths WKRZ and WGGY (FROGGY), both are dominant players in the Top 40 and Country fields, respectively. How much growth did each station experience under your leadership?
KRZ was like a 7-8 share radio station. Within three years we grew to a 9-10 share and we’ve been there ever since. FROGGY has been another great brand! We struggled a little bit about 10 years ago as the format was heading through a major shift musically, but we found our way. The key has been to try and balance the overall sound for our market’s taste, and rebuilding the brand with strong personalities in mornings and afternoons which made a big difference for us.
How fine is the line between Top 40 and Country sharing artists these days, and what are your concerns about brand separation when it comes to your two powerhouse stations?
It depends on the dynamics of the market. In our market, KRZ and FROGGY have about a 25% cross-cume. In major markets I would expect there would be more separation between the two formats. It actually works to our advantage in that KRZ has never been a Rhythmic leaning station so the crossover music that comes from Country works well at KRZ and (in most cases) comes pre-tested based on the research from FROGGY. It’s the demographic composition of this market that makes it possible.
I get concerned about too many Country crossovers coming KRZ’s way, and recently there’s been a lot of Country crossovers with a significant Pop flavor to them. I feel it’s a symptom of the content coming from Pop. However, this year, a number of really decent songs have dropped on Top 40 and that’s exciting!
Country also has become a very dynamic genre with songs that sound like Rock, Pop and even what I call “Grunge.” It’s about as mass appeal as it ever has been, and I believe it’s the most vibrant format out there right now.
How does the significant cross-cume, weigh into your programming decisions?
The 25% cross-cume between KRZ and Froggy speaks for itself. Country crossovers make sense for KRZ, but it’s just as important that we balance the sound and not saturate the playlist. Wilkes-Barre/Scranton is a perfect example of how all markets are not the same and you can’t blindly program with consolidated research. I can guarantee you that this kind of sharing doesn’t happen in most markets, especially the majors. This is a very unique market and I think the key concept here is one-size programming doesn’t fit all.
You’re always assessing the medium in general, what were your thoughts entering 2024?
I did a lot of thinking about where radio is as we entered the new year. You always hear people say, “we’re losing cume, we’re losing people, they’re going away,” and the dreaded, “we’re not relevant anymore” comments. The question needs to be how do we get in front of new, potential cumers, and reenergizing recently lost cumers who may have changed their listening habits. I don’t believe that radio is irrelevant. People like radio because we are more than just a jukebox or playlist. However, sometimes people start doing something a bit different and need to be reminded we are here including entertaining local shows, community outreach and programming for your region. I think we forgot that we need to continuously be out in front of the people…the voters! Recharge the base and from a sales standpoint, find new business! You can’t do that from the studio alone. We have very strong personalities with big brands that should be on the streets doing bits, talking to people, and getting THEM to talk about our brands.
What are you hoping this accomplishes and what are the challenges of this strategy?
As I said, you just can’t manage TSL. You need to bring back new and lost people. Having a healthy cume not only helps stabilize your numbers but also increases the odds of getting some nice quarter hours from a household. More contests, more teases and more show promos help, but they do nothing for the cumers we are trying to catch or welcome back.
The challenge becomes resources. We are working harder with fewer people. Technology has been so instrumental to increase our efficiency and that is huge. However, it makes it harder to get out there and accomplish some of the things I touched on. Who has street teams? How many times does your talent go out and do the show on the road or hang with people? If listeners stray away from the brand for whatever reason, they need to be re-engaged some other way. We need to find them!
Any final thoughts?
I think at times we take our eye off the things we do very well. I get it! We need to get into as many spaces that we can to promote our brands and make a dollar. It makes total sense and I support that 100%. Maybe we could also consider that some of the most effective ways we can grow is by nurturing simple, personal relationships with our community. I always remind our talent that we are “stars” to many out there and we should always greet them and treat them with respect. That’s how you make loyal fans of a brand!
